What Would Dan Druff Do - Hotel Reservation Edition

[anonamoose]

So I'm traveling to Hong Kong with my mother in November. I have been a diamond, top tier, member with Shangri-La Hotels and Resorts for about 2 years now due to my constant travel throughout Asia. I accumulated approximately 37000 reward points during this time, 1 point per dollar spent, and since Shangri-La is a nice hotel with the best views of the best parts of the cities they are located in, it was a no brainer to shoot off my points at the Shangri-La Kowloon.

Now I had enough points to book 5 nights out of the 7 we are staying in a standard room with a side harbour view, meaning partially obstructed by buildings and such. The harbour view is the good view in the hotel. There was another level up, the Horizon Club, that we could only get 4 nights with my points which offered a full view but we settled for side view because it's about 440 bucks a night for the extra nights just for that room and way more for the higher level room. So I went ahead and booked the room and didn't think any more of it.

My mom was complaining a little bit about the price so I went to their website just to double check, what I found really made me kind of pissed. We paid 3050 HKD for our room which was stated on the premier members, Shangri-La Golden Circle, website as the "Best available rate". When I searched I saw our same room for 2593 HKD at "Advanced purchase rate". What further made me angry was when I noticed that there was a full harbour view room at our level of room we selected for 2890 HKD, which had a better view and was cheaper. So I shot off the following email to the Golden Circle customer service:

I recently made a reservation for Hong Kong Kowloon where I booked 5 nights with my points and another 2 nights with money. The reservation had cost 3050 HKD a night for the nights I had to pay. Your website is currently advertising a 2593 HKD advanced purchase rate for this same room. Deluxe with side Harbor view. Even the rate for a full Harbor View is less than what we were charged at 2890 HKD.The confirmation number for this reservation is xxxxxxxx. If possible, I would like to change the reservation for the Deluxe Room Full Harbor View at 2890 HKD. I am a Diamond member and do not need any additional add on's because I already receive them with my Diamond status. If you cannot make change the cost of our two extra night, we may have to find a new hotel for those nights.Thank you.

To which they replied:

Dear Mr. xxxxxx,

Greetings from Golden Circle Member Services.

Thank you for your e-mail of 19 September 2013.

We have taken note that you wish to amend your current reservation from the Best Available Rate of HKD 3,050++ nightly (Deluxe City View room) to Advance Purchase Rate of HKD 2890++ nightly (Deluxe Harbour View room) on 8 - 10 November 2013.

Kindly be informed that Deluxe Harbour View room is not applicable in the Redemption group. If you were booked the Deluxe Harbour View room on 8 - 10 November 2013, please be advised that you will have to change your room on 8 November 2013. Alternatively, we recommended you to amend the Advance Purchase Rate for the same room category (Deluxe City View room) at HKD 2593++ nightly.

We would appreciate your attention of the terms and conditions of Advance Purchase Rate below:
Minimum advance booking 30 days required
Does not apply to group bookings
Credit card prepayment for full duration of stay is required at time of booking
Prepayment will not be refunded for cancellations, shortened stays or rate adjustments
Credit card used at time of booking is required to be presented during check-in
Amendments to stay dates will be subject to a non-refundable re-booking fee equal to the first night room charge plus applicable taxes. This charge can be used as a credit for non-rooms related charges at the hotel, such as restaurant, room service or telephone. The credit is not valid for room charges and cash paid outs
Amendments made to stay dates are subject to a rate adjustment at the time of making the change

Please advise your acceptance as well as choice of changes, in order for us to amend your reservation. Kindly also inform us of your date of birth as well as your mobile phone number, for the verification purpose.

Mr. Xxxxxxx, we look forward to hearing back from you soon. Please do not hesitate to contact us if we may be of further assistance to you. We are also pleased to inform you about the “City Triple” promotion – From now until 30 September, you can earn up to triple GC Award Points and double qualifying nights at our city hotels. Register now for this promotion to enjoy a sensational summer getaway!

Yours sincerely,

Annie Chen
Member Service Executive, Golden Circle Member Services
Shangri-La International Hotel Management Ltd

I was happy that they offered me the rates that I requested, however the thing that really REALLY gets under my skin is that they don't offer the full harbour view room to their members. This absolutely blows my mind because they literally throw shit at me when I normally go to Shangri-La's. They give me free beer, free wine, free food, and so on. I can't count the number of times I've returned to my room to find a giant bottle of nice red wine or a 6 pack of beer.

It just blows my mind that they will not offer up this room to it's loyalest customers. I am also still ticked that they tried to charge me an extra 500 HKD, which I would have ended up paying if I had not checked the website. They're essentially taking almost an extra 100 dollars off their loyal customers by booking through their member website.

I responded with the following:

Annie,

Thanks for the response. While I'm still not happy about this, I will maintain my reservation but would like the 2593 HKD price on the twin bed side harbour view room, with a preference on a smoking room, that I currently have booked.

I am disappointed that as a diamond golden circle member the full harbour view is not available for redemption with my points. I would think that your hotel would put a priority on its most loyal customers to have this stunning view of Hong Kong, but I guess I was incorrect to assume this. I understand that it is not your fault and that it is apparently some policy the company has, but it is disappointing nonetheless.

Anyway, please revise the reservation to reflect the 2593 HKD price. My mobile phone number is (United States) xxx-xxx-xxxx and my date of birth is xx/xx/xxxx.

Thanks,

I have also since fired off an email to corporate customer support explaining the situation to see if they might step in, explaining that if some resolution is not made that I will be taking my business elsewhere. I do not have a copy of this email as it was a form on a website, but when I get a response (probably sometime over night because they are HQ in Hong Kong) I will post it here.

So my question is what would Dan Druff do here to get the full harbour view room or would he just let it go?

TL;DR: Hotel overcharged for a hotel room to it's top tier members and wouldn't offer a standard room with the best view for redemption with points even though they offer it on the nicer rooms with points. Tell me they'll give me the correct price, but still will not let me book the better room with my points.

[Dan Druff]

On my phone now so I can't type a long response to this.

I think you might have screwed up, though.

You just got a very standard discount by making your reservation non-cancellable and non-changeable.

I avoid those like the plague.

So they didn't do you any favor at all.

[anonamoose]

On my phone now so I can't type a long response to this.

I think you might have screwed up, though.

You just got a very standard discount by making your reservation non-cancellable and non-changeable.

I avoid those like the plague.

So they didn't do you any favor at all.

The points expire at the end of the year so if I couldn't make it I would be losing them regardless, because I wouldn't be able to make it by any other time before the end of the year, and I left my job that had me traveling internationally recently so it's not like I'm going to be over there that much anymore. The only Shangri-La near me that I could possibly do a weekend trip to is Toronto, which screw Toronto. I will still be charged for 1 night of the reservation I paid for even with the higher price so we're looking at 3050 HKD vs ~5000 HKD. We're looking at a difference of about 200 USD.

[unchainedghost]

Holy shit

Is this a site that complains exclusively about comps and terrible customer service?

[anonamoose]

Holy shit

Is this a site that complains exclusively about comps and terrible customer service?

This is probably the first email I've sent to a customer support in about 5 years. I don't think my complaint isn't valid here. I'm traveling half way across the world and staying at a luxury hotel that I've handed 37000 dollars to over the last two years only to get a half assed view when they have a better view they're just not offering even though there is rooms available. It isn't the way I'd treat my best customers and as such I'm complaining to them about it.

[Dan Druff]

Okay, I'm back home now, so I can give you a better response.

First off, e-mail customer service is the absolute WORST. Never use it unless you absolutely have to (i.e. there is no way to call anyone).

Why is e-mail customer service the worst? There are a few reasons:

1) It is staffed with cut-rate empoyees (often outsourced) with little authority to bend/modify the rules

2) They do not spend much time on each e-mail. They quickly skim the e-mails, make an assumption as to what you're asking, and respond.

3) It is easier to say "no" via e-mail than the telephone. This is because the person cannot instantly argue back, and even if they do, they can "control" the argument by simply responding again with something similar, where it's much harder to do that on the phone and get away with it.

It does not surprise me at all that you got this answer.

Second, as I said before, Annie did not do anything for you. All she did was cancel your existing reservation (which you can do anyway for a full refund at this point), and rebook it under a different pricing category (which, again, you could have done for yourself).

Many hotels are now offering a discount for you to waive your right to cancel. That's what "Advance Purchase" means. It doesn't just mean you're buying in advance. It means you're buying in advance (usually 3 weeks or more) AND are not allowed to cancel or change anything!

Hotels love this because they can guarantee occupancy weeks in advance, and it helps them set accurate pricing on their remaining rooms.

"But I'm saving a lot of money here," you say.

From what I've found, I can frequently do better than the "Advance Purchase" rate in various ways, WITHOUT having to deal with those crappy restrictions.

If it were just you, I would say it's probably no big deal. I assume you are either young or middle-aged, and the chance of your health going south and destroying the trip before November is not very high -- worth the risk for the lower price, for sure.

BUT...

What about your mother? What if she gets sick?

You're just needlessly introducing rigid restrictions where they aren't necessary.

So here is what I would do (and do it SOON) ....

1) Call up the hotel and ask for the front desk manager. Make sure you are actually speaking to the real manager of the front desk, and not just the highest ranking person there at the moment.

2) Explain that you are a very frequent traveler to their hotel chain, and have spent about $37,000 overall.

3) Explain that you are taking your mother with you, and that her health isn't good, and this might be the last vacation she ever takes. Tell them that you were really looking for a nice view for her, and hoped you would get one given your longtime and frequent patronage of the hotel.

4) Ask him to see if there's any way he can manually upgrade you to a full view.

Make sure to kiss a lot of ass, don't sound angry/nasty/frustrated, and definitely make the call when you're in a decent mood.

You're asking the manager for a favor here.

The good news is that they will often do you these favors, just to be nice. The backstory about your mother will help you in this situation. Don't whine about what they offer to members with points. That's irrelevant here, and will just make you sound like an asshole.

If you fail with the front desk manager, you might want to try to speak to his boss (ask who that is). But only do this if he outright refuses. Don't bring up talking to his boss unless it has completely failed.

You also can't "take your business elsewhere" at this time (at least not for THIS reservation), because now you're locked into a prepaid rate. If you do decide to back out of this reservation, you can probably do so by explaining to the manager that you did not understand that long, convoluted e-mail from Annie as to what you were changing. But only do that if you're uncomfortable with the Advance Purchase BS.

If the manager won't help you, at least have them change it back to the regular rate for now (you can always revert to the Advance Purchase crap in a few days), and see if you can find any discount codes online that will bring the rate down without any kind of restrictions.

A good example of this (though it won't help you here) is the little-known Hilton MVP rate.

Hilton properties (which includes many other brands such as Hampton) also have this obnoxious Advance Purchase crap, but the MVP rate often gets you an even better price with no restrictions. And it's completely legal! You just need to know the right code to enter.

This chain may have something similar.

GL

[Dan Druff]

Here is an example of a front desk employee helping me out:

When I went to NYC last year, I wanted to stay in a certain hotel with a nice Times Square view.

I had a discount code, but the website had an error. Basically, it cost $100 to upgrade to the good view, but if you did that, it would erase the discount you got from your code, so the cost would end up being way more than $100 to upgrade. This was not intended, and was just an error in how the website operated.

I called the property. I got the front desk. I told the guy on the phone what was happening. He then started asking me all kinds of weird personal questions.

"Are you traveling by yourself, or with your family?"

"What's the purpose of this trip? Business or pleasure, or both?"

"Where are you from? When was the last time you were in New York?"

I kind of wanted to tell him this was none of his fucking business, but I answered them all in a friendly manner, thinking that for some reason this guy wanted to feel like we were making some kind of personal connection before helping me.

Sure enough, he then said, "Okay, well I just upgraded you to a room with a view for no extra cost."

I never even asked for that. I just wanted him to book it for the correct price that the website failed to give. Obviously I was thrilled and thanked him profusely.

So the bottom line is that a lot of time you will get help, provided you go to the right people and do so with the right attitude -- at least when it comes to getting upgrades at hotels.

There is also the "$20 trick", but I wouldn't waste my time with that garbage when your stay is 7 days long. It's better to know what type of room you're getting when coming into the whole thing.

[anonamoose]

Solid advice and I'm going to try some of this out, but I won't be able to call the hotel directly since it's in Hong Kong. They do have a 1-800 number corporate hotline, I don't know if I can shoot my angles that way as well or not but I do know their corporate HQ is in Hong Kong.

Also, the paid reservation is tied in with the with point redemption system which you can only do online on the members website. So both the free part of the stay and the paid part are included in the reservation, and this was the only way to do this on the member's website because otherwise reservations are done via their standard website.

When it came to room selection time the only options were best available rate (the 3050 HKD rate), best available rate + breakfast, best available rate + business package. There were no other selections available. Since I already have free breakfast, vip lounge, suit pressings, and so on with my status. Picking anything above best available rate is just paying for something I already get for free. I suppose I could ask to cancel the paid part of the reservation and book through their website, but that seems like it's going to take a lot of hoops to jump through at this point.

[Dan Druff]

Solid advice and I'm going to try some of this out, but I won't be able to call the hotel directly since it's in Hong Kong. They do have a 1-800 number corporate hotline, I don't know if I can shoot my angles that way as well or not but I do know their corporate HQ is in Hong Kong.

Also, the paid reservation is tied in with the with point redemption system which you can only do online on the members website. So both the free part of the stay and the paid part are included in the reservation, and this was the only way to do this on the member's website because otherwise reservations are done via their standard website.

When it came to room selection time the only options were best available rate (the 3050 HKD rate), best available rate + breakfast, best available rate + business package. There were no other selections available. Since I already have free breakfast, vip lounge, suit pressings, and so on with my status. Picking anything above best available rate is just paying for something I already get for free. I suppose I could ask to cancel the paid part of the reservation and book through their website, but that seems like it's going to take a lot of hoops to jump through at this point.

Don't bother with the corporate hotline. That is what you use for service complaints (if you actually stay at the hotel, something is screwed up, and they won't make it right), but not for complaints about rates or asking for favors. What you want is totally on the local property level.

With all of my Jew complaining, I've only once called a corporate line about a hotel, and that was where my then-girlfriend was outright cheated at the spa (they overbilled), and the property refused to correct it. But that's a textbook reason to call the corporate number. Yours isn't.

BTW "Best Available Rate" does NOT mean you're getting the very best possible deal. It means that you're getting the lowest STANDARD (rack) rate available at the time of booking. It also does not mean that your rate will be adjusted if it goes down as time passes. You need to keep track of that and do it yourself.

At hotels, you are really best served at the local property level for just about everything, except in cases where you are cheated (or have a bad service experience) and the property won't make it right. The local property has a lot of power over things, whereas the main reservation number is staffed with powerless call-center types, and the corporate people don't get involved with consumer issues unless they are valid complaints.

[anonamoose]

Solid advice and I'm going to try some of this out, but I won't be able to call the hotel directly since it's in Hong Kong. They do have a 1-800 number corporate hotline, I don't know if I can shoot my angles that way as well or not but I do know their corporate HQ is in Hong Kong.

Also, the paid reservation is tied in with the with point redemption system which you can only do online on the members website. So both the free part of the stay and the paid part are included in the reservation, and this was the only way to do this on the member's website because otherwise reservations are done via their standard website.

When it came to room selection time the only options were best available rate (the 3050 HKD rate), best available rate + breakfast, best available rate + business package. There were no other selections available. Since I already have free breakfast, vip lounge, suit pressings, and so on with my status. Picking anything above best available rate is just paying for something I already get for free. I suppose I could ask to cancel the paid part of the reservation and book through their website, but that seems like it's going to take a lot of hoops to jump through at this point.

Don't bother with the corporate hotline. That is what you use for service complaints (if you actually stay at the hotel, something is screwed up, and they won't make it right), but not for complaints about rates or asking for favors. What you want is totally on the local property level.

With all of my Jew complaining, I've only once called a corporate line about a hotel, and that was where my then-girlfriend was outright cheated at the spa (they overbilled), and the property refused to correct it. But that's a textbook reason to call the corporate number. Yours isn't.

BTW "Best Available Rate" does NOT mean you're getting the very best possible deal. It means that you're getting the lowest STANDARD (rack) rate available at the time of booking. It also does not mean that your rate will be adjusted if it goes down as time passes. You need to keep track of that and do it yourself.

At hotels, you are really best served at the local property level for just about everything, except in cases where you are cheated (or have a bad service experience) and the property won't make it right. The local property has a lot of power over things, whereas the main reservation number is staffed with powerless call-center types, and the corporate people don't get involved with consumer issues unless they are valid complaints.

They forwarded the email to the individual hotel. I called and spoke with them and said they'd review it but it would take a couple days because they were on holiday. They just got back to me today by email and said they have upgraded me to the full harbor view. There was no mention of my mother, I mentioned she has a bad back and what not they just simply stated because of my diamond status they'd do it.